{"id":56088,"date":"2016-05-02T12:37:18","date_gmt":"2016-05-02T17:37:18","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/?p=56088"},"modified":"2026-10-22T11:33:41","modified_gmt":"2026-10-22T16:33:41","slug":"podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/","title":{"rendered":"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking"},"content":{"rendered":"

What does it mean to live a “life of the mind”?<\/p>\n

Why is it important that we make time to ponder and contemplate the heftier ideas of what it means to be a human?<\/p>\n

And if we have the desire to lead a contemplative life, how exactly do we go about doing it?<\/p>\n

Well, my guest today has spent his life pondering and thinking about these questions. His name is Father James Schall<\/a>. He’s a Jesuit priest, philosopher, and the Professor of Political Philosophy at Georgetown University. Father Schall has written on a wide variety of topics, but today on the show we focus on his book The Life of the Mind: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking<\/a>, <\/em>in which he expounds on ways of approaching thinking so that it delights and edifies us. Today on the show, Fr. Schall and I discuss what it means to take part in the Great Conversation, why the life of the mind has some drudgery to it, and brass-tacks things we can all do to live a more thoughtful and contemplative life.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

What does it mean to live a “life of the mind”? Why is it important that we make time to ponder and contemplate the heftier ideas of what it means to be a human? And if we have the desire to lead a contemplative life, how exactly do we go about doing it? Well, my […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":3,"featured_media":195813,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[502,156,42388],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-56088","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-character","category-podcast","category-self-improvement"],"featured_image_urls":{"large":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197-538x280.png","medium_large":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197-768x432.png","aom":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197-372x230.png","reactor-320":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197-320x180.png","reactor-640":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197-640x360.png"},"yoast_head":"\nPodcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking | The Art of Manliness<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking | The Art of Manliness\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"What does it mean to live a “life of the mind”? Why is it important that we make time to ponder and contemplate the heftier ideas of what it means to be a human? And if we have the desire to lead a contemplative life, how exactly do we go about doing it? Well, my […]\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"The Art of Manliness\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:publisher\" content=\"http:\/\/facebook.com\/artofmanliness\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2016-05-02T17:37:18+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2026-10-22T16:33:41+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197.png\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:width\" content=\"1280\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:height\" content=\"720\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:type\" content=\"image\/png\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Brett\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:creator\" content=\"@artofmanliness\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:site\" content=\"@artofmanliness\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Brett\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"1 minute\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\\\/\\\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"Article\",\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/#article\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/\"},\"author\":{\"name\":\"Brett\",\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/#\\\/schema\\\/person\\\/84a51044fb965564cde35d18f7e0a832\"},\"headline\":\"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking\",\"datePublished\":\"2016-05-02T17:37:18+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2026-10-22T16:33:41+00:00\",\"mainEntityOfPage\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/\"},\"wordCount\":191,\"image\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/#primaryimage\"},\"thumbnailUrl\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/wp-content\\\/uploads\\\/2016\\\/05\\\/197.png\",\"articleSection\":[\"Character\",\"Podcast\",\"Self-Improvement\"],\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"copyrightYear\":\"2016\",\"copyrightHolder\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/#organization\"}},{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/\",\"url\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/\",\"name\":\"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking | The Art of Manliness\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/#website\"},\"primaryImageOfPage\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/#primaryimage\"},\"image\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/#primaryimage\"},\"thumbnailUrl\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/wp-content\\\/uploads\\\/2016\\\/05\\\/197.png\",\"datePublished\":\"2016-05-02T17:37:18+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2026-10-22T16:33:41+00:00\",\"author\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/#\\\/schema\\\/person\\\/84a51044fb965564cde35d18f7e0a832\"},\"breadcrumb\":{\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/#breadcrumb\"},\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"ReadAction\",\"target\":[\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/\"]}]},{\"@type\":\"ImageObject\",\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\",\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/#primaryimage\",\"url\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/wp-content\\\/uploads\\\/2016\\\/05\\\/197.png\",\"contentUrl\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/wp-content\\\/uploads\\\/2016\\\/05\\\/197.png\",\"width\":1280,\"height\":720},{\"@type\":\"BreadcrumbList\",\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/character\\\/self-improvement\\\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\\\/#breadcrumb\",\"itemListElement\":[{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":1,\"name\":\"Home\",\"item\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/\"},{\"@type\":\"ListItem\",\"position\":2,\"name\":\"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking\"}]},{\"@type\":\"WebSite\",\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/#website\",\"url\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/\",\"name\":\"The Art of Manliness\",\"description\":\"Men's Interest and Lifestyle\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"SearchAction\",\"target\":{\"@type\":\"EntryPoint\",\"urlTemplate\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/?s={search_term_string}\"},\"query-input\":{\"@type\":\"PropertyValueSpecification\",\"valueRequired\":true,\"valueName\":\"search_term_string\"}}],\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\"},{\"@type\":\"Person\",\"@id\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/#\\\/schema\\\/person\\\/84a51044fb965564cde35d18f7e0a832\",\"name\":\"Brett\",\"sameAs\":[\"http:\\\/\\\/artofmanliness.com\"],\"url\":\"https:\\\/\\\/www.artofmanliness.com\\\/author\\\/brett\\\/\"}]}<\/script>\n<!-- \/ Yoast SEO Premium plugin. -->","yoast_head_json":{"title":"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking | The Art of Manliness","robots":{"index":"index","follow":"follow","max-snippet":"max-snippet:-1","max-image-preview":"max-image-preview:large","max-video-preview":"max-video-preview:-1"},"canonical":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/","og_locale":"en_US","og_type":"article","og_title":"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking | The Art of Manliness","og_description":"What does it mean to live a “life of the mind”? Why is it important that we make time to ponder and contemplate the heftier ideas of what it means to be a human? And if we have the desire to lead a contemplative life, how exactly do we go about doing it? Well, my […]","og_url":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/","og_site_name":"The Art of Manliness","article_publisher":"http:\/\/facebook.com\/artofmanliness","article_published_time":"2016-05-02T17:37:18+00:00","article_modified_time":"2026-10-22T16:33:41+00:00","og_image":[{"width":1280,"height":720,"url":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197.png","type":"image\/png"}],"author":"Brett","twitter_card":"summary_large_image","twitter_creator":"@artofmanliness","twitter_site":"@artofmanliness","twitter_misc":{"Written by":"Brett","Est. reading time":"1 minute"},"schema":{"@context":"https:\/\/schema.org","@graph":[{"@type":"Article","@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/#article","isPartOf":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/"},"author":{"name":"Brett","@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/#\/schema\/person\/84a51044fb965564cde35d18f7e0a832"},"headline":"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking","datePublished":"2016-05-02T17:37:18+00:00","dateModified":"2026-10-22T16:33:41+00:00","mainEntityOfPage":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/"},"wordCount":191,"image":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/#primaryimage"},"thumbnailUrl":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197.png","articleSection":["Character","Podcast","Self-Improvement"],"inLanguage":"en-US","copyrightYear":"2016","copyrightHolder":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/#organization"}},{"@type":"WebPage","@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/","url":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/","name":"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking | The Art of Manliness","isPartOf":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/#website"},"primaryImageOfPage":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/#primaryimage"},"image":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/#primaryimage"},"thumbnailUrl":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197.png","datePublished":"2016-05-02T17:37:18+00:00","dateModified":"2026-10-22T16:33:41+00:00","author":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/#\/schema\/person\/84a51044fb965564cde35d18f7e0a832"},"breadcrumb":{"@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/#breadcrumb"},"inLanguage":"en-US","potentialAction":[{"@type":"ReadAction","target":["https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/"]}]},{"@type":"ImageObject","inLanguage":"en-US","@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/#primaryimage","url":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197.png","contentUrl":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/197.png","width":1280,"height":720},{"@type":"BreadcrumbList","@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/character\/self-improvement\/podcast-197-on-the-joys-and-travails-of-thinking\/#breadcrumb","itemListElement":[{"@type":"ListItem","position":1,"name":"Home","item":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/"},{"@type":"ListItem","position":2,"name":"Podcast #197: On the Joys and Travails of Thinking"}]},{"@type":"WebSite","@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/#website","url":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/","name":"The Art of Manliness","description":"Men's Interest and Lifestyle","potentialAction":[{"@type":"SearchAction","target":{"@type":"EntryPoint","urlTemplate":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/?s={search_term_string}"},"query-input":{"@type":"PropertyValueSpecification","valueRequired":true,"valueName":"search_term_string"}}],"inLanguage":"en-US"},{"@type":"Person","@id":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/#\/schema\/person\/84a51044fb965564cde35d18f7e0a832","name":"Brett","sameAs":["http:\/\/artofmanliness.com"],"url":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/author\/brett\/"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/56088","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/3"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=56088"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/56088\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/195813"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=56088"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=56088"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.artofmanliness.com\/app-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=56088"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}