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	<title>Comments on: 4 Personal Finance Principles That Would Make Your Grandfather Proud</title>
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	<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/</link>
	<description>Men&#039;s Interests and Lifestyle</description>
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		<title>By: Jon</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-2/#comment-329076</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2013 16:30:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-329076</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My GrandFather used to say &quot;Make hay while the sun is shining&quot; as a farmer he understood timing was essential. put the hay up while it is wet and it will mold and be useless. Leave it in the field too long and the winter snow will cover it. This applies to me in my daily life all the time. when there is opportunity for overtime at work, make the most of it. later when there are budget restraints we will not be so fortunate. Take advantage of every oppurtunity when it presents itself, you may not get another!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My GrandFather used to say &#8220;Make hay while the sun is shining&#8221; as a farmer he understood timing was essential. put the hay up while it is wet and it will mold and be useless. Leave it in the field too long and the winter snow will cover it. This applies to me in my daily life all the time. when there is opportunity for overtime at work, make the most of it. later when there are budget restraints we will not be so fortunate. Take advantage of every oppurtunity when it presents itself, you may not get another!</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-2/#comment-286102</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2012 03:20:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-286102</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My grandfather always told me to take a public speaking class/be comfortable with public speaking. He said that in life he has been successful because he was able to talk with people and to groups of people.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My grandfather always told me to take a public speaking class/be comfortable with public speaking. He said that in life he has been successful because he was able to talk with people and to groups of people.</p>
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		<title>By: George</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-2/#comment-254210</link>
		<dc:creator>George</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Sep 2012 18:54:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-254210</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Regarding bringing back the notepad: although it&#039;s no way near as cool and old-school, chances are you&#039;re carrying a phone or Ipod of some sort with a &#039;notes&#039; facility to type things- thus saving packet space.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding bringing back the notepad: although it&#8217;s no way near as cool and old-school, chances are you&#8217;re carrying a phone or Ipod of some sort with a &#8216;notes&#8217; facility to type things- thus saving packet space.</p>
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		<title>By: Marguerite</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-1/#comment-164257</link>
		<dc:creator>Marguerite</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Oct 2011 02:03:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-164257</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It is rather off-topic, but my husband&#039;s uncle (from India) took the negotiating part a bit too far... rather amusing to see him trying to negotiate prices with the sales clerk at Macy&#039;s!

(More on-topic, it sounds like my mother: &quot;why buy something you can&#039;t afford?&quot; &quot;why spend money you don&#039;t have?&quot;  -- good advice!)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is rather off-topic, but my husband&#8217;s uncle (from India) took the negotiating part a bit too far&#8230; rather amusing to see him trying to negotiate prices with the sales clerk at Macy&#8217;s!</p>
<p>(More on-topic, it sounds like my mother: &#8220;why buy something you can&#8217;t afford?&#8221; &#8220;why spend money you don&#8217;t have?&#8221;  &#8212; good advice!)</p>
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		<title>By: barter411</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-1/#comment-163991</link>
		<dc:creator>barter411</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Oct 2011 15:34:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-163991</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I like the part how grandpa lived leanly, saved, and was grateful for what he had; How staying out of debt was a matter of independence, pride, and self-reliance, and reflected on a man’s character. 

Hard as it is, LBYM (living BELOW your means) should be a goal that propels us to make whatever change is needed. If we have to rip the phone and cable TV out of the wall to get there then that is what we do.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like the part how grandpa lived leanly, saved, and was grateful for what he had; How staying out of debt was a matter of independence, pride, and self-reliance, and reflected on a man’s character. </p>
<p>Hard as it is, LBYM (living BELOW your means) should be a goal that propels us to make whatever change is needed. If we have to rip the phone and cable TV out of the wall to get there then that is what we do.</p>
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		<title>By: Diocletian</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-1/#comment-163672</link>
		<dc:creator>Diocletian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Oct 2011 15:04:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-163672</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@ngdoms,

you said:

&quot;because you don’t live in a magical bubble that allows you to have clean water, roads to drive on, electricity, safe food, safe neighborhoods, etc. etc. etc. Unless you think the private sector will magically get you there on their own free will instead of charging you out the ass for it, then by all means, please explain to me how this would work. 

It would work as the provision of any other good or service for sale in the private sector works: entrepreneurs, motivated by profit made possible to earn by consumer demand, build and maintain clean water, roads, safe food, electricity, neighborhood security, etc. etc. to consumers who value and desire them in exchange for proper (market-determined) payment. No one creates goods and services of &quot;their own free will&quot;, that is, free of charge. You are to pay for them, and yes, &quot;out the ass&quot; if you want top-quality goods and services. You are not entitled to these things for free. It sounds as if you believe that you are. If so, YOU are the one in need of a reality check. You certainly pay &quot;out the ass&quot; for things that the public sector &quot;provides&quot; in the form of coercive taxation. The fundamental and important difference is that when the government &quot;provides&quot; something, you are forced to pay for it whether you use/consume it or not. With a private-sector good/service, you are free to choose whether you will purchase it or not, and if you do not, you still have your cash available to purchase something else instead; or, if you are unsatisfied, you can take your business to another private-sector competitor.

You have had the false premise that &quot;only the government can efficiently and cost-effectively provide roads, safe food and water, utilities, roads, security, etc., etc. pounded into your head since you were a child, and like a religious belief, you never once dared to allow yourself to think independently and critically examine that premise and consider a private sector alternative would (and can) work to produce and provide those things. 
You said:

&quot;problem with you people is that you think every government program is a scam because a very small percentage of people may be abusing the system. So instead of trying to deal with the abuses on a case by case basis or attack the systemic problem at its core (corporate money) you just want to abolish every government program until they are operating out of a box on 1600 penn ave.&quot;

My position is that government welfare schemes are worse than scams because (1) they are forcibly funded. THAT&#039;S the systemic problem, not &quot;corporate money&quot;, and that is what makes them all fundamentally immoral and unjust--to say nothing of their being unconstitutional (2) they explicitly, undeniably, encourage the development of a dependent/entitlement mentality. THAT is far a greater abuse experienced by every participant of every one of those schemes that far surpasses the abuses to those programs by people gaming them. (3) there is no real accountability, which facilitates the abuses that you speak of, perpetrated mainly by those who staff these programs, or channel people to them (social workers) because the funding is presumed to be limitless due to the government&#039;s ability to print more paper dollars and impose coercive taxes to fund them. Those are just a few of the realities underlying those programs. Before the welfare state and the coercive taxes imposed to fund it were  implemented, gross incomes were higher, the dollar was backed by silver and gold and consequently had higher purchasing power, so family members, private, voluntarily local charities and philanthropic agencies, etc., coupled with individual acts of generosity, were able to amply provide for unemployed, indigent, elderly, or infirm individuals. No &quot;box on 1600 penn. ave.&quot; was required. They were implemented and voluntarily financially supported by generous, benevolent individuals in accordance with their own personal standards of giving and their own private property rights. 

You said:

&quot;seriously…where do you think the internet came from...?

It&#039;s intellectual &quot;founding father&quot; was J.C.R. Licklider, a computer scientist at MIT, a private research university. Although the government has been involved with the internet throughout its development, the internet was not created by the government, and the internet we know and use today is largely the result of private sector efforts. Check its history for yourself. So much for your accusation of my being a hypocrite.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ngdoms,</p>
<p>you said:</p>
<p>&#8220;because you don’t live in a magical bubble that allows you to have clean water, roads to drive on, electricity, safe food, safe neighborhoods, etc. etc. etc. Unless you think the private sector will magically get you there on their own free will instead of charging you out the ass for it, then by all means, please explain to me how this would work. </p>
<p>It would work as the provision of any other good or service for sale in the private sector works: entrepreneurs, motivated by profit made possible to earn by consumer demand, build and maintain clean water, roads, safe food, electricity, neighborhood security, etc. etc. to consumers who value and desire them in exchange for proper (market-determined) payment. No one creates goods and services of &#8220;their own free will&#8221;, that is, free of charge. You are to pay for them, and yes, &#8220;out the ass&#8221; if you want top-quality goods and services. You are not entitled to these things for free. It sounds as if you believe that you are. If so, YOU are the one in need of a reality check. You certainly pay &#8220;out the ass&#8221; for things that the public sector &#8220;provides&#8221; in the form of coercive taxation. The fundamental and important difference is that when the government &#8220;provides&#8221; something, you are forced to pay for it whether you use/consume it or not. With a private-sector good/service, you are free to choose whether you will purchase it or not, and if you do not, you still have your cash available to purchase something else instead; or, if you are unsatisfied, you can take your business to another private-sector competitor.</p>
<p>You have had the false premise that &#8220;only the government can efficiently and cost-effectively provide roads, safe food and water, utilities, roads, security, etc., etc. pounded into your head since you were a child, and like a religious belief, you never once dared to allow yourself to think independently and critically examine that premise and consider a private sector alternative would (and can) work to produce and provide those things.<br />
You said:</p>
<p>&#8220;problem with you people is that you think every government program is a scam because a very small percentage of people may be abusing the system. So instead of trying to deal with the abuses on a case by case basis or attack the systemic problem at its core (corporate money) you just want to abolish every government program until they are operating out of a box on 1600 penn ave.&#8221;</p>
<p>My position is that government welfare schemes are worse than scams because (1) they are forcibly funded. THAT&#8217;S the systemic problem, not &#8220;corporate money&#8221;, and that is what makes them all fundamentally immoral and unjust&#8211;to say nothing of their being unconstitutional (2) they explicitly, undeniably, encourage the development of a dependent/entitlement mentality. THAT is far a greater abuse experienced by every participant of every one of those schemes that far surpasses the abuses to those programs by people gaming them. (3) there is no real accountability, which facilitates the abuses that you speak of, perpetrated mainly by those who staff these programs, or channel people to them (social workers) because the funding is presumed to be limitless due to the government&#8217;s ability to print more paper dollars and impose coercive taxes to fund them. Those are just a few of the realities underlying those programs. Before the welfare state and the coercive taxes imposed to fund it were  implemented, gross incomes were higher, the dollar was backed by silver and gold and consequently had higher purchasing power, so family members, private, voluntarily local charities and philanthropic agencies, etc., coupled with individual acts of generosity, were able to amply provide for unemployed, indigent, elderly, or infirm individuals. No &#8220;box on 1600 penn. ave.&#8221; was required. They were implemented and voluntarily financially supported by generous, benevolent individuals in accordance with their own personal standards of giving and their own private property rights. </p>
<p>You said:</p>
<p>&#8220;seriously…where do you think the internet came from&#8230;?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s intellectual &#8220;founding father&#8221; was J.C.R. Licklider, a computer scientist at MIT, a private research university. Although the government has been involved with the internet throughout its development, the internet was not created by the government, and the internet we know and use today is largely the result of private sector efforts. Check its history for yourself. So much for your accusation of my being a hypocrite.</p>
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		<title>By: joel</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-1/#comment-163665</link>
		<dc:creator>joel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Oct 2011 07:05:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-163665</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hey Guys 

I found the art of manliness site by accident a few months ago and love it!! This post is so true and like everyone else I think the attitude of our grandfathers generation is summed up by the mentality of &quot;hard work&quot; and &quot;you deserve nothing&quot;. In our generation of credit cards and multi media advertising it&#039;s easy to fall into the trap of &quot; I want, I want, I want&quot; mentality and spiralling into debt. We can learn so much from our parents and Grandparents and we need to be examples for our kids!!.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Guys </p>
<p>I found the art of manliness site by accident a few months ago and love it!! This post is so true and like everyone else I think the attitude of our grandfathers generation is summed up by the mentality of &#8220;hard work&#8221; and &#8220;you deserve nothing&#8221;. In our generation of credit cards and multi media advertising it&#8217;s easy to fall into the trap of &#8221; I want, I want, I want&#8221; mentality and spiralling into debt. We can learn so much from our parents and Grandparents and we need to be examples for our kids!!.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Pettorini</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-1/#comment-163638</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Pettorini</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Oct 2011 18:43:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-163638</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A favorite memory of my grandfathers is they never complained. The did what they had to do. They did not point the finger of blame at someone else for their own situation. They managed their money, raised families, fought wars and were upstanding, law-abiding, tax-paying, voting Americans. And they were proud to be. Their memory stands as a constant reminder of what it means to be a man, in any generation. Thank God for them!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A favorite memory of my grandfathers is they never complained. The did what they had to do. They did not point the finger of blame at someone else for their own situation. They managed their money, raised families, fought wars and were upstanding, law-abiding, tax-paying, voting Americans. And they were proud to be. Their memory stands as a constant reminder of what it means to be a man, in any generation. Thank God for them!</p>
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		<title>By: Shane</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-1/#comment-163585</link>
		<dc:creator>Shane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Oct 2011 16:44:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/?p=20321#comment-163585</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[One thing that really makes me mad when older generations complain about the younger generation just expect everything, is that the parents who are part of that older generation just gave the younger generation whatever they wanted as they were growing up. Many of the Baby Boomers just don&#039;t want their kids to be unhappy, so they just give them whatever they ask for. And they are the ones who are running all these big businesses telling the younger generation that they deserve whatever product they are selling through their marketing. If you just give kids whatever they want, and then tell them that they deserve nothing when they are about to enter the real world, what do you honestly expect their reaction to be? The blame has to go both ways.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One thing that really makes me mad when older generations complain about the younger generation just expect everything, is that the parents who are part of that older generation just gave the younger generation whatever they wanted as they were growing up. Many of the Baby Boomers just don&#8217;t want their kids to be unhappy, so they just give them whatever they ask for. And they are the ones who are running all these big businesses telling the younger generation that they deserve whatever product they are selling through their marketing. If you just give kids whatever they want, and then tell them that they deserve nothing when they are about to enter the real world, what do you honestly expect their reaction to be? The blame has to go both ways.</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan S</title>
		<link>http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/09/20/4-personal-finance-principles-that-would-make-your-grandfather-proud/comment-page-1/#comment-163514</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2011 04:47:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[Aaron, my apologies, I didn&#039;t read your last post until after posting mine.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aaron, my apologies, I didn&#8217;t read your last post until after posting mine.</p>
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